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Noise from the Y axis

skysurferskysurfer Posts: 37🌟 Super Member 🌟
edited July 2018 in Modifications & Upgrades
Hello together,

I have some weird Y-axis sounds that you can hear in the attached video.

Whether these are really about fixing the drivers, which I can not believe
I have already exchanged for DRV8825 and have no changing by this noise.

Can it come from the mechanic ?


Src: https://jgauroraforum.com/uploads/editor/eb/wludw63opta7.mp4
Post edited by Samuel Pinches on

Comments

  • Samuel PinchesSamuel Pinches Posts: 2,596Administrator
    Some of the sounds I hear sound like they are coming from the extruder motor (e.g. clicking noises)?

    The loud y-axis noise are fairly common - you may want to add some lubrication to your y-axis bearings to mitigate the loud noises.
  • skysurferskysurfer Posts: 37🌟 Super Member 🌟
    edited August 2018
    Yes... somes noices are coming from the extruder motor ... a new one is ordered,
    and the other noises comes from the y-axis.
    The reason is not the lubrication. 
    The printer is disassembled on the workbench.
    When i know move the Y-axis with hand, there are no abnormal noises to hear and no defective bearings to feel with the hand and the axis does not run dry. The axis is running very smoothly.

    I suspect the belt tensioner.
    The bearings for the deflection can do in the bracket what they want, they have to much places on sides.
    Is very nice to see the abrasion in the holder.

    And i think that this noise only occurs with fast driveways and hard accelerations, which then rubs the bearing on the holder, vibrates the holder, and transmits these vibrations across the housing.

    The space between the bearings and the holder is now solved with disks from 0,4 mm per side, so the bearings
    run in the middle from the holder.

    More, with pictures, if I have fixed this.
    I have to wait for parts to steam
    Post edited by skysurfer on
  • skysurferskysurfer Posts: 37🌟 Super Member 🌟
    edited August 2018
    Hi,
    here some picture and what i have done.


    Here you can see the space between the bearings and tensioner


    comes from grinding from the bearings


    with discs the game balanced, 0.4 mm per side


    The side to the lid is covered with 1 mm cellular rubber to avoid hard contact with the lid

    rebuild


    By the rebuilding i found out that the space in the threat is too high, the tensioner moving is to big.
    I protect it with two self-assured nut.



    Now i wait for an new chain, because the have taken a smaller one.
    Post edited by skysurfer on
  • Samuel PinchesSamuel Pinches Posts: 2,596Administrator
    Thanks for sharing your work, hopefully it fixes the issue. Please let us know your results once you have tested it :smile:

  • skysurferskysurfer Posts: 37🌟 Super Member 🌟
    Samuel,

    yes i do it ...
    actually a wait for the new chain and the tl-smoother.
    When all is here, then i hope i get my A3S silent and with very good printing.
  • skysurferskysurfer Posts: 37🌟 Super Member 🌟
    edited August 2018
    The test say's .... it was NOT the belt tensioner.
    So the next step is ... to control the linear bearings ..
    The Linear guides are not try ... i have olid it before ca. 3 weeks, so i think the linear bearings inside are try.

    Post edited by skysurfer on
  • Samuel PinchesSamuel Pinches Posts: 2,596Administrator
    You may want to try a thicker grease, rather than just an oil. E.g. PTFE grease, or similar.
  • skysurferskysurfer Posts: 37🌟 Super Member 🌟
    My experience is, that the grease on the linear guides does not work because the linear guides at the entrance and exit have wipers to prevent soiling from entering the bearings. Thus, the grease would only be pushed over the guides, but not come into the linear bearing to the balls.

    The linear bearings must get grease inside, in the ball guides, so that the balls in your guide are lubricated.
    I have new linear bearings LMU8xx here, but no tool to remove the circlips. Tomorrow I buy a tool and replace the linear bearings with new ones. The new ones are previously filled with grease in the ball guides.


  • skysurferskysurfer Posts: 37🌟 Super Member 🌟
    edited August 2018
    Now, after a long and hard job it's done.
    Samuel, it was not the linear bearings.

    What i have done:
    - change the linear bearings to new one with grease inside
      Test -> no improvement

    - change the linear bearings to IGUS slide bearings
      Test -> no improvement

    - change the motor to an new one, which i bought for the extruder
      Test -> at first it lokks a little better, but after a vew minutes i like to start the test again
                 but the motor shows now movment, the Y-axis was stuck and the motor was broken,
                 no more movement on the shaft possible, this is stuck

    - change the JGAurora Motor #42to an Geeetech Motor which i had here from my other Printer
       the printer have now DRV8825 driver and IGUS slide bearings
      Test -> no noises on the Y-axes B) B)

    [Video missing]


    So, i will never ever buy an JGAurora Motor #42, because the typ's a very bad, now i have three motor's here where are defect.

    The next step will be, to change the driver from the x and y axes to TMS2208, for Z and E i will use the standard driver with TL-Smoother and so i hope i get a silent printer with good prints



    Post edited by skysurfer on
  • Samuel PinchesSamuel Pinches Posts: 2,596Administrator
    Did you try tuning the stepper drivers?
    https://jgaurorawiki.com/a5/stepper-drivers
  • skysurferskysurfer Posts: 37🌟 Super Member 🌟
    edited August 2018
    >Did you try tuning the stepper drivers?

    This was the first which i have done ... also by changing to the DRV8825 drivers

    orgin
             SOLL            |      IS      | changing
          Axis = Vref       |                |
        X = 0.4 - 0.55V  | 0,4908 V | no
        Y = 0.4 - 0.6V    | 0,4940 V | no
        Z = 0.7 - 0.85V  | 0,8082 V | no
        E = 0.55 - 0.6V  | 0,4652 V | 0,5871 V

    DRV8825
    VRef
        X = 0,610 V
        Y = 0,614 V
        Z = 0,616 V
        E = 0,624 V
    Post edited by skysurfer on
  • skysurferskysurfer Posts: 37🌟 Super Member 🌟
    edited August 2018
    Hi,

    actually staus .... wait for a new MKS GEN L V1.0.
    The story ...
    by the last print, the extruder motor was very hot .... you can not take the fingers on it, and the filament was blocked in the feeder. The feeder was totally filled with filament and to get it away from the feeder, the only solution was with temperature.

    Until now, i have changed the driver to the TMC2208 and the X, Y and Z axes runs good.
    The nois from the Y-axes is very reduced but not tottaly gone as i had with the DRV8825 driver and the Geeetech motor.

    After the new orgin JGAurora motor was killed by testeing the Y axes and i have got the Geetech motor to run, i like to take also an Geeetech motor for the Extruder.

    By testing, the Extruder motor turns max. 3 stepes and then stand still.
    No action on every moving commands.

    What i have tested:
    - connect the Geeetech motor to the Y-axes
      -> the motor run's good
    - change the driver from Extruder to the Y-axes
      -> the motor runs good
    - check the changing cabeling more times
      -> no misstake found
    - rebuild all and connect the motor on the extruder cable
      -> the motor runs only max 3 steps and it was

    I think, by the last print, the MKS board has gotten something by this high temperature.
    Now i must wait for the new board.
    Post edited by skysurfer on
  • skysurferskysurfer Posts: 37🌟 Super Member 🌟
    edited August 2018
    Hi,

    the job is done B) B) B)

    The loudest in printing are now the fans.
    The noises from Y axes is gone.

    The Board is not defect, i have check today the wiring from the Board to the Extruder once more and found the misstake.
    The misstake is the wire color changing from the board over the inside/external connector.
    You can see it at the following picture.


    I must only exchange the red and white wire by the motor connector and in the Firmware the direction for the Extruder.
    And now the Geeetech/Casun Motor runing on the Y axis and extruder very well.

    Thanked by 1Samuel Pinches
    Post edited by skysurfer on
  • AndreAndre Posts: 16🌟 Super Member 🌟
    I got my A5 this weekend. Not assambled yet. Moving the heatbed by hand, it sound very noisy. So I disassembled the printer and checked the bearings. Only one moved smooth, the others were noisy like hell, one even got stuck for a Moment. An absolutly no-go.
    So I printed new bushings with iglidur i150 https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:24990 .
    They are a little tight printed on a Prusa mk3 with 0.4 nozzle, 0.98 flow rate, 250Β°C nozzle and 85Β°C heatbed (using printafix) and 60% infill. But using a 10mm drill, rubbing and rotating a few times in the hole, I got them sliding perfectly on the rods. The only noise to hear now is the stepper motor.
    I prefer to print with Iglidur i150 against using  ready to use bearings, as the material ist more stiff and you can make the inner side perfectly smooth and fit to the rod using a drill and squeze the bearing just enough to abrase a tiny bit of material. Of course I made 5-7 trys of drilling per bearing (everyone time abraising only a very smal amount) until it was exactly the smooth movement I wanted, but now it's perfect. But after tigtning the holders, you have to loose the screws a quarter of a turn again, else the bearings will be squezed against the rod and block. I used locktide to prevent to get more loose.

    Of course I have no long-term experience now (as I have to do some other modifikations before assembling the printer), but I did something simular in my p3steel and it worked well there.

    Iglidur costs about 30€/250g. But bearings are light. Having a spool of this filament you can print enough bearings for many printers. You can make exactly the bearings you want, effectivly without paying more than ordering standard ones. And it will perfectly fit your printer (you may also print bearing and holder as one part)

    Be aware that only i150 is usable on normal printers. Everything else from iglidur need heated chamber. Also it does not stick well in PEI. But printafix works perfectly.

    Changing linear bearings ist the first thing to do on the A5 - before the low quality ball bearings grind into the rod.

    Cheap bad bearings also can cause secondary problems: like overheating of stepper motors. So I strongly recommend a change before first use of the A5 If something sounds stange while moving the bed manualy.


  • Samuel PinchesSamuel Pinches Posts: 2,596Administrator
    I totally agree about the cheap bearings. The bearings on my A5 were pretty bad, but I put up with it. The bearings on my A5S, the bed in particular, were terrible!! Like you said, they were hard to move and got stuck in some places. So I finally decided to act... I contacted a few highly rated bearing manufacturers on aliexpress and asked them to make a pack of all the bearings used on the x and y axis. I negotiated the price down to $30USD delivered. Not cheap, but I’m hoping good quality. I’ve ordered some, and I’ll post the results when they arrive.

    bearing pack on aliexpress:
    https://sampin.ch/A5-bearings
    Thanked by 1Andre
  • AndreAndre Posts: 16🌟 Super Member 🌟
    Yes, buying high quality bearings is also a good idea. The main reasons to print them myself:

    - in other projects I had problems after replacing rods by higher quality ones. Chinese ones are mostly imperial sizes, German ones are metrical. So in case I have to change rods (for exemple bend them by accident), I can simply widen the iglidur bearings using a drill. Of course this wouldn't work with ball bearings.

    - ballbearings are normaly called "8mm" or "10mm" even if they are made for imperial sized rods. Nearly no chance to know before trying. If you have imperial sized rods, but get metrical bearings, they a a bit loose.

    - I already have ilgidur i150 from other projects, so no waiting for delivery...

  • netzmarknetzmark Posts: 107🌟 Super Member 🌟
    Have you also replaced the bearings on X axis?
    My Y are also noisy like hell (I get the sound like from broken springs) but alo my X are shity as well. They have a lot of clearance (like 0.1-0.2mm feeling by hand). Unfortunately my printer has plastic holders where the X linear rods are holded and it look like quite hard to disassemble without the brokening them. Maybe pronting X-bearings together with the holders will be a better idea...
    I'm curious wheter you have it the same and how did you solve it.
  • MikeG183MikeG183 Posts: 9Member
    Had the same issue on my Magic. I second replacing the motor. Also replaced the bearing and pulley as follows:

     I noticed that the y-axis belt was pretty loose out-of-the box. My y-axis motor went out and I noticed it when I went to replace it. I replaced the y-axis motor with this: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07LF898KN/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o03_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1. I had to trim the stem a few mm so it didn't hit the build plate. I also replaced the plastic pulley with this: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B077GNZK3J/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o08_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1. I also replaced the tensioner bearing with this: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01H3FNZ4M/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o01_s01?ie=UTF8&psc=1. I noticed that the stock tensioner bearing did not have enough of a lip on it, and the y-axis belt would slip and rub on the plastic. I also made sure that the belts were all better aligned. Finally, I replaced the z-axis motor with the same unit that I replaced with the y-axis. Notably, these motors are completely plug and play (other than having to trim the stem down. Base layer prints perfectly now.
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